calling wolfman and any other workout specialists

[bru333]

Only if the person's cardio system, nutrition balence and consumption of water is ideal. Those that consume alcohol will definately inhibit the body's ability to flush the toxins.

Lactic acid isn't a toxin...

Lactic acid - friend or foe?

Lactic acid (lactate) is not:

* responsible for the burn in the leg muscles when exercising very fast
* responsible for the soreness you experience in the 48 hours following a hard session
* a waste product

Lactate, which is produced by the body all day long, is resynthesized by the liver (Cori Cycle) to form glucose which provides you with more energy. Sounds like a friend to me.

Lactate Shuttle

The lactate shuttle involves the following series of events:

* As we exercise pyruvate is formed
* When insufficient oxygen is available to breakdown the pyruvate then lactate is produced
* Lactate enters the surrounding muscle cells, tissue and blood
* The muscle cells and tissues receiving the lactate either breakdown the lactate to fuel (ATP) for immediate use or use it in the creation of glycogen
* The glycogen then remains in the cells until energy is required

65% of lactic acid is converted to carbon dioxide and water, 20% into glycogen, 10% into protein and 5% into glucose.
Hydrogen ions

The breakdown of glucose or glycogen produces lactate and hydrogen ions - for each lactate molecule, one hydrogen ion is formed. The presence of hydrogen ions, not lactate, makes the muscle acidic which will eventually halt muscle function. As hydrogen ion concentrations increase the blood and muscle become acidic. This acidic environment will slow down enzyme activity and ultimately the breakdown of glucose itself. Acidic muscles will aggravate associated nerve endings causing pain and increase irritation of the central nervous system. The athlete may become disorientated and feel nauseous.

[Joe 1320]

OK...... what website was this pulled from?

Probably the one that starts with this:

The lactic acid system is capable of releasing energy to resynthesise ATP without the involvement of oxygen and is called anaerobic glycolysis. Glycolysis (breakdown of carbohydrates) results in the formation of pyruvic acid and hydrogens ions (H+). A build up of H+ will make the muscle cells acidic and interfere with their operation so carrier molecules, called nicotinamide adenine dinucleotide (NAD+), remove the H+. The NAD+ is reduced to NADH which deposit the H+ at the electron transport gate (ETC) in the mitrochondria to be combined with oxygen to form water (H2O).

If there is insufficient oxygen then NADH cannot release the H+ and they build up in the cell. To prevent the rise in acidity pyruvic acid accepts H+ forming lactic acid which then dissociates into lactate and H+. Some of the lactate diffuses into the blood stream and takes some H+ with it as a way of reducing the H+ concentration in the muscle cell. The normal pH of the muscle cell is 7.1 but if the build up of H+ continues and pH is reduced to around 6.5 then muscle contraction may be impaired and the low pH will stimulate the free nerve endings in the muscle resulting in the perception of pain (the burn). This point is often measured as the lactic threshold or anaerobic threshold or onset of blood lactate accumulation (OBLA).

The process of lactic acid removal takes approx. one hour, but this can be accelerated by undertaking an appropriate warm down which ensures a rapid and continuous supply of oxygen to the muscles.

The normal amount of lactic acid circulating in the blood is about 1 to 2 millimoles/litre of blood. The onset of blood lactate accumulation (OBLA) occurs between 2 and 4 millimoles/litre of blood. In non athletes this point is about 50% to 60% VO2 max and in trained athletes around 70% to 80% VO2 max.

Nutrients Which Improve Lactic Acid Metabolism

The first one that comes to mind is creatine. In “Creatine, The Power Supplement”, Richard Kreider, PhD explains that increasing phosphocreatine [in the myocyte] through creatine supplementation may enhance performance by buffering acid [hydrogen ions], mitigating the formation of lactic acid and reducing the reliance on anaerobic glycolysis as a replenishment source of ATP.

HMB (ß-hydroxy-ß-methylbutyrate) is also a great asset. Steven Nissen PhD has shown that athletes taking HMB can exercise at a higher intensity and/or for a longer period of time when compared to a placebo. HMB seems to help the body burn intramuscular fatty acids preferentially over carbs. HMB improves VO2 peak, increases the time it takes to reach VO2 peak and increases lactic acid threshold. For more info and references, check out www.mettechinc.com.

Hydration is monumental to health & performance and it’s surprising how few people including athletes adequately hydrate themselves. A group of scientists in the United Kingdom examined the effects of ingesting a 6% carbohydrate-electrolyte solution on athletes (versus a placebo) during 90 minutes of intermittent high-intensity running. Serum insulin and blood glucose concentration was maintained for longer periods and blood lactate after 30 minutes of exercise was lower compared to water only (Medicine & Science in Sports & Exercise, September 1999).

Sodium bicarbonate and phosphate both help beat the burn. So do carnosine and carnitine. Standardized panax ginseng extract spares glycogen and increases fatty acid oxidation. When you spare glycogen as a fuel source in exercise you can usually extend the time it takes to reach your tolerance to acid as it builds up. Of course the food you eat also contributes in a powerful way. Unlike the Canadian average (20%) at least sixty percent of your dietary profile should consist of alkaline food. But that’s another whole article in itself!


Supposedly the idea that it takes one hour to remove the lactic acid is based on trained athletes with a monster cardio system who also drink enormous amounts of water. The average person doesn't seem to be so lucky. Since alcoholic beverages have the function of dehydration, this make the situation worse. Hydration is the key to the whole issue.

[Joe 1320]

To continue, what that translates to is:

Lactic acid -- A byproduct of glucose and glycogen metabolism in anaerobic muscle energetics. A minute accumulation causes muscular fatigue and pain, and retards contraction.

Lactic acid is carried by the blood to the liver, where it is reconverted to glucose and returned as blood glucose to the muscles. It is this elevation of blood lactic acid in sustained strenuous exercise, such as in marathon running, which results in muscle fatigue and pain. Recovery follows when enough oxygen gets to the muscle, part of the lactic acid being oxidized and most of it then being built up once more into glycogen. The metabolic cooperation between contracting skeletal muscle and the liver to support active muscle work is called the Cori cycle.


There are various theories that progress to the outright rediculous. People are now buying Lactic Acid to use it for skin peels and skin whitening of all things. It almost sounds like our asian skin whiting spammers are making a fortune.

[Nightrage]

what these guys above said is correct. Now, I'm a strange peep...... i sometimes do the same muscle groups, only i cut the weight in half and increase reps, this give definition and "cut".....but it still tears em down, but not to the point that recovery is that critical.

I thought that doing lighter weight and higher reps just gives endurance? Isn't the "cut" look based solely on bodyfat%? I noticed that since I've started kickboxing, I've had better muscle definition. I'll spar, then work out, then run 1-2 1/2 mile(s). I'm burning tons more calories than I eat

Just out of curiosity, what muscle groups do you guys like to do/ do the most?
I like doing my back and shoulders the most, but I probably work my legs more than anything as they're the most important to me. I can't understand these guys that come into the gym, do biceps/ abs one day and chest the next, then back to biceps/ abs. Nothing but those three muscle groups. There's even a group of middle aged guys that just come into the gym to bench.

[thomas]

I thought that doing lighter weight and higher reps just gives endurance? Isn't the "cut" look based solely on bodyfat%? I noticed that since I've started kickboxing, I've had better muscle definition. I'll spar, then work out, then run 1-2 1/2 mile(s). I'm burning tons more calories than I eat

Just out of curiosity, what muscle groups do you guys like to do/ do the most?
I like doing my back and shoulders the most, but I probably work my legs more than anything as they're the most important to me. I can't understand these guys that come into the gym, do biceps/ abs one day and chest the next, then back to biceps/ abs. Nothing but those three muscle groups. There's even a group of middle aged guys that just come into the gym to bench.

Your right in the way that if you look at alot of big guys there biggest weak point is there legs. Its really mine too. I really like working my back the most with deadlifts the most!! Thats probably the biggest back muscle builder there is for more. Huge results and fast!!

[wolfdogs]

I thought that doing lighter weight and higher reps just gives endurance? Isn't the "cut" look based solely on bodyfat%? I noticed that since I've started kickboxing, I've had better muscle definition. I'll spar, then work out, then run 1-2 1/2 mile(s). I'm burning tons more calories than I eat

Just out of curiosity, what muscle groups do you guys like to do/ do the most?
I like doing my back and shoulders the most, but I probably work my legs more than anything as they're the most important to me. I can't understand these guys that come into the gym, do biceps/ abs one day and chest the next, then back to biceps/ abs. Nothing but those three muscle groups. There's even a group of middle aged guys that just come into the gym to bench.

1. body fat is the key..but what burns it better ? works for me... granted, power lifting gives tremendous bulk if the technique is right, swimming and aerobics elongate muscles...to me, less weight at a cardio pace fills the gap between the extremes.

2. tri's,bi's, chest, shoulders, and my back, which is the strongest muscle group i have, the only thing i can attribute that too is from my 30 some odd years of surfing...especially from the old days, paddeling those 10 foot long boards a 1'2 mile or more out to the reefs in Hawaii, surfing all day, and paddling back........... and im glad they are....

a lady friend of mine at the gym, she's from Pannama, had an auto accident 3 years ago...she was in a vett...got knocked into the gaurd rail and sent her air born, the car flipped three times (rolled). she had no damage to her back at all...... the doctors asked her if she worked out...her back muscles were very developed and helped to stabilize her spine...

[Joe 1320]

the doctors asked her if she worked out...her back muscles were very developed and helped to stabilize her spine...

Same thing here. After a severe accident, the doctors remarked that being a bodybuilder had saved my life. If I hadn't been so well muscled, my neck and back would have snapped like a twig.

[Nightrage]

Speaking of accidents, I just found out that my two of my girlfriend's friends were in an accident. The guy was driving his girlfriend home, who lives maybe 4 minutes away of they hit traffic and he falls asleep at the wheel. He wound up rear ending a parked car which smacked into another one in front of it. Somehow, she fell asleep before he did, so she couldn't wake him up... at least this is the story. I kinda find it hard to believe since for the last 2 1/2 years, I've been taking either 30 minute trips home alone, or an hour round trip when dropping my girlfriend off or driving home from her house. Not only am I yet to fall asleep, I'm yet to catch myself starting to nod off. I feel horrible for him. He had just been in an accident a few months ago (hit by a drunk driver) and used the insurance money to get a 95 Z28. He loved this car, now he wrecked it. They both escaped unscathed, but he wrecked his dream car. They say they were tired before they left his house. They're within walking distance. Why the heck didn't he just walk her home if he knew he was tired? Either they didn't think they'd fall asleep, or he was driving like an idiot. Either way, I'm glad no one was hurt. Poor kid