Really dumb!

[Jeff_in_Atl]

That makes zero sense Jeff. I dont know of any families that would intentionally stay away from a event just beacause it was going to have people with their pets around. Let's get back to reality.

Well you do now. And I know several people who have complained about it. You just read an article about it. It has gotten so bad they are outlawing pit bulls and rotwilers in a lot of places. The lady that had the face transplant the other day had it because a dog tore her face up. That's reality!

Here is a link to the US constitution, amendments, and bill of rights. http://www.house.gov/house/Educate.shtml . I've read it and can not find anything in it that gives a person a right to take a dog to a public event. I can't even find where it says anything about dogs.

Liberty as explained in Merriam-Webster http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/liberty is "1 : the quality or state of being free: a : the power to do as one pleases b : freedom from physical restraint c : freedom from arbitrary or despotic control d : the positive enjoyment of various social, political, or economic rights and privileges e : the power of choice"

However in the United states liberty is limited to the laws of the country and the law limits one person liberty to not interfere with another persons liberty. Bringing a dog to a public event can limit the liberty of someone who is afraid of dogs to go to that event. Who rules in this country dogs or people?

Narcissism no flaming allowed.

[TraceZ]

Kumbaya my Lord, kumbaya
Kumbaya my Lord, kumbaya
Kumbaya my Lord, kumbaya
Oh Lord, kumbaya




Come on guys!! Hold hands and sing with me!
We can agree to disagree... quoting the bill of rights is kind of silly, no?

[fastTa]

Let me try to awken a few minds by providing some indesputable facts.

Straight from the Humane Society, Animal Legal & Historical Web Center and AKA:

1. 71% of dog attacks happen at home or in a place in which is less than a 1/2 mile from their home.

And the real kicker:

2. 77% of those who are attacked are attacked by a dog who they are familiar with or by a friend's or relative's dog.

The constitutuion was derived in order to provide a moral and logical basis for our judicial system and Goverment to make and enforce law, not to figure out whether a dog should be allowed in a public place. That is precisely what our vast archive of Statutes are for. Most pet laws are left to be mostly interpreted and enforced by local authorities.

Liberty is a great thing and is to be enjoyed by everyone no doubt. However your vague attempt at trying to show a inhibition of liberty out of one's control being held in the hand's of a dog owner is simply rediculous. So by your intolerant ideology, we should provide a Statute in which prohibits anything and everytihng that may infringe on one's idea of his own deprivation of liberty Horsesh%t.

If we passed a law banning everthing that someone found offensive or in some way restrictive of his own idea of deprivation of freedom or liberty, we would live in a very sad sad world.

Flaming is using a derogatory intention. Narcissim is a pathlogical condition and in no way shape or form derogatory. Hind-sight is 20-20 and here is a probably more accurate term is s should have used. Egocentric: 1 : concerned with the individual rather than society

http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/egocentrism

Your so concerned with preventing yourself from having to worry yourself about the "major" task of concerning yourself with the decision to take your kids somewhere based upon whether there will be dogs there or not. Why not concern yourself with something more rational like worrying about whether or not your kid is going to be shot by a fellow disgruntled student.

[fastTa]

Come on guys!! Hold hands and sing with me!
We can agree to disagree... quoting the bill of rights is kind of silly, no?

It's all Bruce's fault.

[Performin Norman]

Once, against my better judgement, I insured a family that had a Chow. When I arrived at the house, the dog was standing at the front door with Mrs. Smith. The dog was excited but wasn't barking. I had heard stories about this breed but this dog seemed harmless. I went inside, petted the dog. I took care of business. We even walked out back so I could take a better look at the physical structure and the condition of the roof. The entire time, the dog was well behaved and didn't bark once.

6 months later, the dog had bitten a neighbor boy in the face. He had to have 30+ stiches in his lower lip. The dog was put down at the owners request.

[markd79ta]

I really like my two dogs. They are pretty cool. They are fun to train, care for, and they have a role in my house. However, my son Jonathan is a child, and my dogs are animals. Yes, the bond with a dog can be very special, and the German Shepherd I had as a kid saved me from being either mauled or killed so I have a very special place in my heart for her...that was here role...to protect me. However, I think dog lovers fail to realize that not all people like dogs, and the owners shouldn't feel so offended when others don't want them around in public. I would never dream of bringing my two German Shepherds to a place that would make people feel uncomfortable, but some people have this expectation that their dogs should be allowed anywhere including the homes of people they visit. My mom almost lost college friends of over 50yrs because they had the audacity to raise heck when my mom forbid their dogs from staying in her house. Now, I think this is ridiculous...how on earth can anyone expect that their dog should be welcome in another person's home, show up on their door step, and then pitch a fit?

As far as I am concerned, my dogs are at the very bottom of the pack order and they are trained as such (even below guests and the general public). If my elderly parents visit, the dogs are confined. My dogs are great, but if they even brush up against one of my frail parents, they could fall down (do those complaining about this ban, think about this?) I wouldn't dream of bringing them to a place where they could scare the heck out of people or cause an accident. For some people, like my parents, it doesn't take much. Shoot, my male, Kodiak, is extremely sweet and well mannered, he rarely barks unless there is a genuine threat. However, when I walk him, people cross the street to avoid walking past us. I know that Kodiak is great, but strangers don't. Personally, I think dog owners need to be more considerate, not the other way around. Here is a good example of something I did wrong. My office is filled with dog lovers so we all occasionally bring in our dog to show the staff. Anyhow, I was leaving my office and didn't think to call out before I rounded a corner of my office building. Well, a person was there, and from out of nowhere she saw Kodiak come around the corner...she jumped and screamed a little. Did Kodiak bark, lunge, or make any movement? No, he was perfectly behaved, but this person just saw a large intimidating dog and didn't know what to expect. So, to end a long post, this event probably produces a lot of stimuli, crowds of young and old, and it is probably a good idea to leave the pets at home.

[TraceZ]

In the city I live in, dogs are not allowed in parks or public buildings. There are however a few "dog parks" that are specifically for people with dogs. The only exception is of course service animals.

I think this is a good policy and it seems to work. It's nice to go play frisbee and not worry about stepping in crap every 5 minutes. I know I'm not alone when I say I find dogs to be somewhat disgusting animals. They crap and pee everywhere, and will even eat their own feces. They dont clean their own coats and smell terrible if not maintained and bathed. Next time a dog licks your face remember thay might of been eating their own crap 3 minutes prior. Yum, just what I want all over my face. I had a friend with 2 dogs in a 1 bedroom appt. That place stunk so bad I actually went out on the patio and puked the one and only time I was there. I never went back because the smell was so bad.

A little off topic, but compare this to cats... Cats clean themselves and their fur never smells offensive. They crap in a box and bury it tidily. They dont eat their own feces, ever. They dont bark or slobber and you never hear of a cat significantly disfiguring somebody. I'm convinced that cats are as smart as dogs too. Maybe even smarter in some ways. A farm dog is so loyal it will keep going back to an owner that beats it. Farm cats are smart enough to flee that situation, or at least stay far away from the abuser. The dog will keep coming back for more like it can't learn a lesson.

I wouldnt ever take our cat to any public event. He could get freaked out and hurt somebody. Even though it would be a little injury, it would still be enough to have regrets. And he is like part of the family.

[braindeadracefan]

They dont bark or slobber

My cat slobbers...

[fastTa]

In the city I live in, dogs are not allowed in parks or public buildings. There are however a few "dog parks" that are specifically for people with dogs.

The only exception is of course service animals.

I think this is a good policy and it seems to work. It's nice to go play frisbee and not worry about stepping in crap every 5 minutes. I know I'm not alone when I say I find dogs to be somewhat disgusting animals. They crap and pee everywhere, and will even eat their own feces. They dont clean their own coats and smell terrible if not maintained and bathed. Next time a dog licks your face remember thay might of been eating their own crap 3 minutes prior. Yum, just what I want all over my face. I had a friend with 2 dogs in a 1 bedroom appt. That place stunk so bad I actually went out on the patio and puked the one and only time I was there. I never went back because the smell was so bad.

A little off topic, but compare this to cats... Cats clean themselves and their fur never smells offensive. They crap in a box and bury it tidily. They dont eat their own feces, ever. They dont bark or slobber and you never hear of a cat significantly disfiguring somebody. I'm convinced that cats are as smart as dogs too. Maybe even smarter in some ways. A farm dog is so loyal it will keep going back to an owner that beats it. Farm cats are smart enough to flee that situation, or at least stay far away from the abuser. The dog will keep coming back for more like it can't learn a lesson.

I wouldnt ever take our cat to any public event. He could get freaked out and hurt somebody. Even though it would be a little injury, it would still be enough to have regrets. And he is like part of the family.

Ever remember seeing cat crap in a neighbor’s yard? I do. Cats are constantly crapping in everyone's yards. Also, although dog owners generally get all the beef, they are always there for their dogs, cat owners don't bother. Don't be so smug Tracy! Did you know that feline feces is in most cases carrying a microscopic worm that has the likely potential to create sterility in women as well as men; not to mention causing a plethora of birth defects if women are exposed to cat crap. Dogs also have a certain Bacteria in their, but their is far more money and time spent in the immunization efforts in this regard, thus it is kept much more under wraps than the problems that cats pose. Cats don't get nearly the same recognition. I wonder why. Additionally, dogs by instinct, leave their feces on the surface of the ground. Cats on the other hand instinctively bury their feces if outdoors and this allows these harmful microorganisms to live for years under the soil.

Dogs aren't the only ones who piss on everything as well. Cats are far more territorial than dogs and hence "mark" everything they can with their urine. Speaking of stinch; especially during a mating cycle. Even the cats that are said to be indoor cats still have to be trained to go crap in some little indoor litter box. Speaking of stinch again. Taking care of a litter box unmistakibly reminds me of taking care of an elderly human who has lost control of their bowel and urinary control. Bravo for the cat.

I absolutely hate when "cat lovers" say that cats are more independent than dogs. Not even close. What they mean to say is that all of the cat owners neighbors have to provide a place in which for the cat to crap, sleep, and puke it's pointless recently killed small rodents.

Then you have the "cat lover" allegation that cats are smarter than dogs. This one cracks me up man. Ask any scientist or animal trainer how the intellectual capacity of an animal is measured and they will tell you that it is measured based on a structure of the ability to learn, socialize, and adapt and learn human interactivity. Dolphins, monkeys, and dogs do this very well because of their eagerness to learn and more so their desire to please, but cats are too naive and engulfed by their inherently inept ability to do this. Heck, some breeds of dogs (Rhodesian Ridgebacks, Labs, Wolfdogs, Border Collies, and Poodles) have been scientifically proven to learn elementary math and display this knowledge by means of specific numbers of barks or foot stomps. Try that with a cat. How can someone possibly even fathom the possibility of a pet that doesn't even seem to display a integral interest in who I am and sometimes forgets or doesn’t care to come home. I definitely would not want to share my life or home with a person like that.

Ponder this for a moment. Imagine a cat finding someone in an avalanche or buried under a building 9/11? Or what about warning its owner about an intruder in the house? Or checking for drugs and explosives at the airport; maybe defending it's owner against a criminal in the street? Would a cat stand guard over you? Would it leap from a lifeboat into stormy seas to take a life preserver to a drowning man? Would blind and deaf people be given seeing and hearing cats? Of course not, that would be silly. Cats aren't smart enough and they don't care about anyone but themselves. Egocentricity comes to mind again.

Tracy made the naively brave insinuation that dogs are inherently foul disgusting creatures. Is there anyone really so foolish as to think that domestic cats are the result of natural selection? Not. They have been as selectively bred as dogs. Before the house cat became so popular, this country had its own kind of cat - the wild cat. Incidentally, several other members of the canids family; the fox, and the wolf are still found throughout North America unthreatned by their "Man's Best Friend."

[Jeff_in_Atl]

... quoting the bill of rights is kind of silly, no?

There was a reason for this. The statement

So because 1 child is scared of dogs in general, you are saying that NOBODY should feel that it is their right to bring their dog to the very same picnic?

was made saying someone had the right to bla bla bla. My point was nobody has the right to bring their dog to a picnic. Nowhere does it say that in the bill of rights. At least I didn't see it. Yes it is silly but so is assuming that everyone will be OK with your dog. That is simply not true. I am not OK with it and I love dogs. I have to fight the urge to pet all of them but I know not all dogs will allow that. Mine won't. I hate it when people come up to put my dog because he will bite you. That's why I don't take him out of the back yard unless I have to. Now before anyone goes on here saying that is my fault let me tell you why he is like this. I have always kept my dogs behind a fence. One day I caught some kids picking at him throwing rocks and kicking dirt at him. I even caught one kid shooting a home made arrow at him from a home made bow. My neighbor did not have a fence across his back yard so the kids would use his yard for a cut through and terrorize my dog in the process. I asked him and even offered to pay to put a fence up on his property but he wouldn't do it. So I couldn't stop the kids from terrorizing him. Now he doesn't like people he doesn't know. But people all the time assume because he is a dog that he is OK to pet. They come up to him and stick their hand down before I can say stop. He's an old fart now but he still will bite if he doesn't know someone. At least he doesn't "bite the hand that feeds" (NIN).

As I said earlier, last year I had a dog try and bite me at my wife's company picnic. The dog had "never done that before". If I had been shorter or (a child) he would have bitten me. No one should be in fear from someone's dog at an event made for people. Period.

Mark79ta said it a lot better than me. "However, I think dog lovers fail to realize that not all people like dogs" and "Personally, I think dog owners need to be more considerate" and "….it is probably a good idea to leave the pets at home.". Well said.

[TraceZ]

Ever remember seeing cat crap in a neighbor’s yard? I do. Cats are constantly crapping in everyone's yards. Also, although dog owners generally get all the beef, they are always there for their dogs, cat owners don't bother. Don't be so smug Tracy! Did you know that feline feces is in most cases carrying a microscopic worm that has the likely potential to create sterility in women as well as men; not to mention causing a plethora of birth defects if women are exposed to cat crap. Dogs also have a certain Bacteria in their, but their is far more money and time spent in the immunization efforts in this regard, thus it is kept much more under wraps than the problems that cats pose. Cats don't get nearly the same recognition. I wonder why. Additionally, dogs by instinct, leave their feces on the surface of the ground. Cats on the other hand instinctively bury their feces if outdoors and this allows these harmful microorganisms to live for years under the soil.

Dogs aren't the only ones who piss on everything as well. Cats are far more territorial than dogs and hence "mark" everything they can with their urine. Speaking of stinch; especially during a mating cycle. Even the cats that are said to be indoor cats still have to be trained to go crap in some little indoor litter box. Speaking of stinch again. Taking care of a litter box unmistakibly reminds me of taking care of an elderly human who has lost control of their bowel and urinary control. Bravo for the cat.

I absolutely hate when "cat lovers" say that cats are more independent than dogs. Not even close. What they mean to say is that all of the cat owners neighbors have to provide a place in which for the cat to crap, sleep, and puke it's pointless recently killed small rodents.

Then you have the "cat lover" allegation that cats are smarter than dogs. This one cracks me up man. Ask any scientist or animal trainer how the intellectual capacity of an animal is measured and they will tell you that it is measured based on a structure of the ability to learn, socialize, and adapt and learn human interactivity. Dolphins, monkeys, and dogs do this very well because of their eagerness to learn and more so their desire to please, but cats are too naive and engulfed by their inherently inept ability to do this. Heck, some breeds of dogs (Rhodesian Ridgebacks, Labs, Wolfdogs, Border Collies, and Poodles) have been scientifically proven to learn elementary math and display this knowledge by means of specific numbers of barks or foot stomps. Try that with a cat. How can someone possibly even fathom the possibility of a pet that doesn't even seem to display a integral interest in who I am and sometimes forgets or doesn’t care to come home. I definitely would not want to share my life or home with a person like that.

Ponder this for a moment. Imagine a cat finding someone in an avalanche or buried under a building 9/11? Or what about warning its owner about an intruder in the house? Or checking for drugs and explosives at the airport; maybe defending it's owner against a criminal in the street? Would a cat stand guard over you? Would it leap from a lifeboat into stormy seas to take a life preserver to a drowning man? Would blind and deaf people be given seeing and hearing cats? Of course not, that would be silly. Cats aren't smart enough and they don't care about anyone but themselves. Egocentricity comes to mind again.

Tracy made the naively brave insinuation that dogs are inherently foul disgusting creatures. Is there anyone really so foolish as to think that domestic cats are the result of natural selection? Not. They have been as selectively bred as dogs. Before the house cat became so popular, this country had its own kind of cat - the wild cat. Incidentally, several other members of the canids family; the fox, and the wolf are still found throughout North America unthreatned by their "Man's Best Friend."

A little sensative about this? Wow! I've made my points and don't need to argue. We can disagree. I dont have a problem disagreing with people about trivial things like cats -vs -dogs, or silly airplane scineroes. As long as we agree on the important things like love, honor, country, F-bodies, etc...


PS.. the airplane takes off!!
Relax, man!

[Jeff_in_Atl]

A little sensative about this? Wow! I've made my points and don't need to argue. We can disagree. I dont have a problem disagreing with people about trivial things like cats -vs -dogs, or silly airplane scineroes. As long as we agree on the important things like love, honor, country, F-bodies, etc...


PS.. the airplane takes off!!
Relax, man!

Agree to all including the air plane takes off.
P.S. people rule animals drool! Funny the old cat that we inherited from my wife's mother drooled. My dog doesn't.

[Blazer]

Well what about my pet pig where does he stand.
Blazer

[Fb0dY HoTTiE LS1]

i think thats rediculous also, i pretty much have a zoo(2 cats, a snake, and a saltwater reef tank) and to me all of my animals are like family, but i cant really take them out to events but if i had a dog i would expect myself to want to bring it places, even with the snake every once in a blue moon i'll bring him out on a little feild trip

[Jeff_in_Atl]

Well what about my pet pig where does he stand.
Blazer

On my dinner plate! He can sit if he wants to.