Suggestions from you experts out there....

[jerrysta]

My goal for my TA has always been to run 12's at the track with a totally streetable car and recently I have gotten my Richmond 3.73's installed to put me one step closer. Haven't been to the track to see the difference yet, but I was running 14.3's.

I am now ready for cam/headers/y-pipe.

What do you guys think would be a good combo? Remember, I want a daily drivable car!

I can't do some of these installs myself, but a friend of mine's father builds race engines and will do the install for me. He did my rear gears for 125 bucks.

What do you guys think?

[Al 96 Ram Air T/A]

Oooo...sorry to hear you went with Richmond. They have they proven to be poor gears for our cars.

That said, if you want to be in the 12's, and maintain streetability, there's only one choice...nitrous. Off the bottle, the car will maintain it's current characteristics. On the bottle, say 125 shot, you'll be in the low 13's to high 12's. It's the cheapest and easiest way to go for sure. Just remember, runnin' in the 12's costs money. Expect about $5k to sustain a 12 second car. Even on nitrous, you have many weak points...i.e. the rear end, suspension (traction limitations), fuel system, exhaust, etc. Any LT1 or LS1 can run in the 12's...the question is, how long before something breaks. In my search for the 12's, I've been methodically strenghtening the weak parts in prep for the additional power. Follow the lead of guys like Fred and Ken...you'll understand what it takes. It's easy to slap on a blower or nitrous but making the car live more than a few passes is the trick. I've seen many guys go the cheap route. They no longer have their cars...Decide how fast you want to go and how long you want the car to last. For me, the only way to get more power is to optimize and strenghten the engine (intake and exhaust work primarily). Once I know the suspension, transmission, and engine can handle the additional ponies, then I'll start to up the power. I don't want a trailer queen, but I also want to invest in parts than will work with future mods AND keep the car alive and kickin' for many years to come. As for power...there will always be someone with a faster car. Nuff said...decide how fast (powerful) you can live with is the real trick. Again, ask Fred. He swore he would never have a "race only" car. However, years later he has just that. It's just to much for the street anymore.
There are pluses and minuses in the search for speed...be prepared to make compromises along the way.

[Joe 1320]

A streetable high 12 is going to be close, but I'll get to that later. What you need to do is eliminate as much parasitic loss as possible. This means lightweight wheels and tires, aluminum driveshaft, bypassing the hot water lines routed to the throttle body, a cold air intake, headers and cat back exhaust, and finally suspension parts that make it hook. I was able to get to 13.05 with 3.23s and have yet to get a timeslip with my 3.73. Now I will say that my LT1 is a little bit of a freak. It is quicker than most LT1s with equivilant mods. Getting back to the streetable portion, if you have an automatic, you'll most lkely need a higher stall torque converter. Here's where is streetability comes into question. I'm not really a fan of the higher revs when accelerating in normal traffic. Even though they lock up at cruise, the initial acceleration does have higher revs, makes more noise, generates more heat, etc. I still say it's possible to crack the 12s without a higher stall speed converter and sooner or later will have the proof to back it up. So, here's my list of what to do:

1. Bypass heat hoses to TB.
2. Cold air intake (SLP or equal)
3. Headers and cat back
4. Lightweight wheels and sticky tires
5. 1LE aluminum driveshaft
6. 1.6 LT4 roller rockers
7. LT4 knock module
8. tubular lower control arms with relocation brackets.
9. Torque arm
10. New computer program.
11. 160º thermostat
12. Underdrive pulleys
13. Lots of practice!

All this without nitrous or any other power adder can get you right at 13.0X, it's been proven many times. Had I run in cool weather instead of summer, maybe there is a high 12 there. Now add the converter......... you can drop .4 with that. There's your high 12s.

Here's a page worthy of reading: http://www.ws6.com/bangbuck.htm

[N20LT4Bird]

Originally posted by Al 96 Ram Air T/A
Oooo...sorry to hear you went with Richmond. They have they proven to be poor gears for our cars.

It's easy to slap on a blower or nitrous but making the car live more than a few passes is the trick. I've seen many guys go the cheap route. They no longer have their cars...Decide how fast you want to go and how long you want the car to last.


There are pluses and minuses in the search for speed...be prepared to make compromises along the way.

First off, I ran Richmonds in my 10 bolt for 3 years. Theyre noisy, but I never had a problem.

Second, 12's is not super hard to attain and remain streetable. With the mod list on my car, without the nitrous, its an easy 12 seccond car. Granted, I have more than just bolt ons, but it is VERY streetable. I have taken it on several 5-6 hour trips with the AC blastin and the tunes cranking.

The one thing I do agree with, is that you will make some trade offs. But, if you weant to run 12's, go for it. GM High Tech performance did an article no too long ago about how to run 12's with ONLY BOLT ONS. There were many guys who achieved this. Its not that hard. Time and money - thats all it is.

[Al 96 Ram Air T/A]

Don't get me wrong, I agree with you. It's just my definition of "streetable" is a little more stingent.

To me, a car with a full roll-cage, no back seat, unbearably loud exhaust, skinnies up front, slapper bars out back, suspension parts designed for drag racin', emissions that can strip paint off cedar siding, and gas mileage that requires you to stop at every other station...this is not streetable. It's kinda' like the guys I hear sayin'..."I run 12's bone stock....{yuck-yuck}" Yeah...right. They seem to overlook the blower because it's only a bolt on. "Bolt-ons don't count...right?" Ummm...no.

A truly "streetable" car to me (again, just my opinion) should look and drive very similar to the way the manufacturer designed it. In other words, your teeth should not rattle loose, you should not have to be an acrobat to get in and out, and you definitely should not have to search high and low for 104 octane gas. I've seen many of "streetable" cars that retained all of their creature comforts and still lay down 500 hp. It's just expensive to do both. Especially if you want to legally run the car at a track. This is why I recommended the nitrous system. With minor head work and simple cat back exhaust, a 125-hp shot of nitrous will give the performance but not sacrifice any streetability.

To me the most streetable car made today (that's not mega pricey) is the Mustang Cobra. Horsepower TV just tested one. Stock on the dyno - 364 at the wheels. (The Mustang dyno they have always seems to be on the conservative side) With a simple HPP computer flash and smaller pulley, it laid down 427 at the wheels...insane numbers for less than $600 in mods. And is it streetable? You bet. Still runs on 92 octane and looks, drives, and feels exactly like it was designed to do so. BUT the catch is...you can't run it at the local track without some mods (i.e. roll cage, fuel cell, wheel studs, fire suit, etc.) With the aforementioned mods, the car is now into the 11's. (I know...my lil' sis runs 12.4 with hers...and she has yet to do anything to the car in the 2,500 miles she has on the car) This is how the expense comes in to play in every "streetable" vs. legal scenario. Finding the happy medium is the fun part.

[Joe 1320]

Originally posted by Al 96 Ram Air T/A


I've seen many of "streetable" cars that retained all of their creature comforts and still lay down 500 hp. It's just expensive to do both. Especially if you want to legally run the car at a track

That says volumes....... my GN is what you could call streetable. No cage, looks pretty much stock, closed exhaust and it runs 10s. Got thrown off the track for the lack off all the extra equipment that would have made the car less streetable. I've spent more time and money on tuning and streetability than I did on bolt on parts. The car isn't a track car, it's a street cruiser. It speaks softly, but carries a big hammer.

[93blackta]

i have seen that same horsepower tv. those were pretty amazing power numbers for a stock car with minor additions.i actualy tried to race one in my 93 ta and he left me in the dust. there was absolutey no contest. but keep in mind that it is a supercharged car. why wouldnt a supercharger be a good way to go. ive seen plenty of streetable cars that are supercharged.

[Al 96 Ram Air T/A]

There's nothing wrong with a supercharger, but it has inherent risks. First off, LT1 motors have fairly high compression ratios right off the bat. It's not uncommon, as the years and miles add up, to have your octane requirements "eek" up slightly. Add a blower and you are walking a very fine line between power and melting your pistons. LT1 pistons have weak upper ring lands, which frequently break upon slight detonation. WHile it will retain streetablilty, you'll probably need to use a heavily intercooled blower or start searching for higher than 92 octane gasoline. Either way involves money and sacrifice. A good intercooled blower is the ATI Procharger, but it's pricey at about $4000 when all is said and done. That's why I recommended the NItrous setup. You can have a turn-key system for about $1,000 with all the bells and whistels, This way, you'll only be putting the extra stresses on the mototr when you feel the need for speed.