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  • I need advice

    Last Thursday (not this Thursday, a week back) I took my car (95 Camaro) in for a small oil leak I noticed. They ran a dye test and found out it was the intake manifold leaking.

    They said it would take until Tuesday (mechanic was off Monday) to fix it, and a cost of $430.

    So I said "No problem" and went on my happy way.

    It is now Friday, and everytime they call it is another story. It was supposed to be done Tuesday, then Wednesday lunch, then Wednesday evening, then Thursday, then Friday lunch, now Friday evening has come and went.

    The first time it was a "stripped thread" when putting the manifold back in. They fooled with that to the point where they wanted to put in a new bracket and bolt (to the tune of $30 for the damn bolt) to which I said "ok" to just get it done and over with.

    Now, they claim that there is a "miss" now that they assembled the manifold back together and they want to take the valve cover off and adjust it -- and they'll only charge me one hours labor for it, wow! They "SWEAR" it will be done tomorrow morning.

    Now, what should I do "if and when" it is done tomorrow morning? I am expecting them to present some bill for well over $1,000 on a job that they quoted me $430 to do work on and I said "ok".

    I'm no fool -- it doesn't take 4 days to replace a stripped thread or bolt.
    1995 Chevy Camaro, V6, 5-spd Manual - Looks like it just rolled off the showroom floor :-)

  • #2
    Did you sign any type of release form and give them a blanket statement that allowed them to go over the predetermined amount?

    If not, give them what was agreed and not a penny more. If they refuse tell them you will take them to small claims court for fruad and misrepresentation and you will be forced to call the BBB and the your chamber of commerce to notify them of their business practices.

    By my math you owe them $460.00...I would pay via credit card so even those charges may be disputed if they wish to play nasty.



    KnightFire
    1993 Formula Firebird
    Check Homepage for mods and photos...

    KnightFire's Lair


    Amsoil Dealer

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    • #3
      they quoted you a price, and unless you gave them an open-ended consent, stand your ground......

      and.....I have suffered the dreaded intake manifold leak twice.....under 25K miles.....

      wolfman developed the fix.....he put me on to it..........basically, the car is not moved for 24 hours after the work, and put a valve cover breather on in place of the oil cap....it's vented and allows excess internal engine pressure to escape.....works like a charm
      DWS
      Silver M6 '95 Formula-sold to MCKNBRD

      Zaino all the way!!

      '03 Z06....Donaldson Blackwing, CAGS, '04 Z06 shocks, ceramic pads

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      • #4
        Thanks you guys; you are always helpful here! I agree, and I think they already know not to pull some fast one on me.

        I am curious -- any reasons one can think of why it would develop a miss when doing the intake? I know the valve cover came off, but can't see how anything that was done would affect any of that -- however, I don't claim to know a lot about the internal workings of the engine itself!

        Thanks again,

        Rob
        1995 Chevy Camaro, V6, 5-spd Manual - Looks like it just rolled off the showroom floor :-)

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        • #5
          I feel your pain, bro. This is scenerio is exactly why I do my own work. There was a time when I didn't know squat.... so I learned by getting shop manuals and doing it. Never went to school for it, but over the last 25 years you would be amazed at what can be learned. Now I can pull an engine, tear it down, send out the block for the machine work, rebuld it when I get the block back. I can fabricate simple items, but nothing too wild. Bolt on stuff is like child's play. My advice is to use this as a motivator to do your own work in the future.

          As an example, I tore down the upper end to do head gaskets. It required removal of the exhaust, accessories, intake and heads. I started after work on Friday, after a hour and a half the exhaust was all removed. Called it a night Got up the next morning and started on the upper end. By just after lunch the heads and intake were already removed, the block surfaces cleaned and everything was ready for reassembly. Put in the new gaskets, reassembled and the car fired right up on the first twist of the key at precisely 5:45 pm. The only finishing touch that was needed was one stud had been broken off on the exhaust manifold (the first one I removed no less ) so the driver's side manifold was bolted to the downpipe with only two studs. Picked up as stud that night and installed it the next morning. You get the greatest feeling of accomplishment when you do it, you know how it's been put together and you know that it's done right. You would be suprised how many times I've opened up a friend's motor that had a "professional" shop do the work and was horrified by what I saw. Silicone sealer everywhere, shoddy cleanup, incorrect vacuum line routing, etc. It makes the owner almost . Hope it goes well for you, but like I said, use this as a motivator to do your own work.

          What can cause a miss? loose ground, incorrect spark plug wire routing, loose spark plug wire, fouled EGR, vacuum leak, loose connections on fuel injectors, intake manifold leak, bad coil pack/module bad plugs, bad wires, and so on. Could be anything bro, without being there to diagnose it all we can do is guess. A shop manual would help you diagnose stuff just like this.

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          • #6
            OK - I'm new around here, but I think I can add some experience here. My father owns a small transmission shop in Syracuse, NY. I have managed this shop as well as been a service writer at another shop, so I know a couple of things about the business. First off, there are a few shops out there with honesty and integrity. My dad's place is one of them and he has mostly repeat customers from all over the area that return just because of his practices. He will bend over backwards to uphold the integrity of his place.

            So, I will tell you that if they are going to charge more than the initial estimate, they must contact you for consent to continue the work, If not, you dont owe another dime. Second, at least in New York, the department of motor vehicles holds the shop owner's license. Not many people know this, but around here, if you even mention reporting a shop to the DMV, generally you win. The DMV would be all over a shop with poor practices with pretty hefty fines and penalties.

            Third, and most important, DO NOT let them hold your vehicle for lack of paying the bill. Pay what you feel you owe and if the shop owner does not give you the keys - call the police. A shop owner cannot hold your vehicle for services rendered. It happens all the time and is unconstitutional. We all have the right to DUE PROCESS and the shop owner will have to sue you for the rest of what he believes you owe him. He cannot STEAL your car until you pay. It's illegal, and any good cop, judge, lawyer etc. would know that. Let us know how it turns out!
            96 WS6 Formula: Ram Air, 383 Stroker, Ported LT4 Heads and Manifold, 1.6 Crane Rollers, 58MM T.B., AS&M Headers, Borla Exhaust, Meziere Elec. H2O Pump, Canton Deep Sump Oil Pan, 100 HP OF TNT N2O!! , T56 Conversion w/ Pro 5.0 shifter, SPEC Stage 3 Clutch, Hotchkiss Subframe Conn., Lakewood Adj. Panhard Bar, Spohn Adj. LCA's, BMR Adj. T.A., Custom 12 bolt w/ 3:73's, Moser Axles, Eaton Posi, Moser Girdle
            11.6 @ 123mph (1.6 60' - getting there )

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            • #7
              I wanted to give you guys an update on this... and I am pleased to say it is a positive one.

              Around 1:30pm Saturday I got a call that the car was ready, and I went over to retrieve it. The mechanic working on it had it still pulled into the bay when I got there. I went up to him and started talking and he started explaining what all they did.

              He informed me that they were having problems adjusting the valves according to the manual, and they actually had to end up using a Chevy 350 reference manual to get the information they needed. He also stated that while he was in doing the work I requested, he went ahead and replaced the O-Rings, no charge, because they were cheap, simple and he knew from past experience they can often fail.

              He further went on to state that he just didn't feel right giving it back to me while they had the miss going on in the engine -- even if it was ever so slight.

              They actually charged me LESS then they quoted, did work above and beyond what I expected, and went to the trouble of cleaning the entire engine compartment afterwards. The car has more HP than ever before, and I am quite pleased.

              They want me to bring it back in later this week to give it a "post-op lookover" to make sure all is right.

              In summary, I am shocked. This guy is probably one of the most honest mechanics I think I have ever met. It took time, but I know that the time it took was well spent and looking back on it now, I'd rather he took the time then rushed the job.

              If you are ever in Columbia, MO and need car repair work done I HIGHLY recommend you get over to Customer Muffler and see Rick.

              A HIGHLY satisifed customer...

              Robert
              1995 Chevy Camaro, V6, 5-spd Manual - Looks like it just rolled off the showroom floor :-)

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              • #8
                You see - not everyone in the auto repair business is a slug! Glad to hear you had a good experience. There needs to be more techs out there like this one and then maybe the business will not have such a bad rap.
                96 WS6 Formula: Ram Air, 383 Stroker, Ported LT4 Heads and Manifold, 1.6 Crane Rollers, 58MM T.B., AS&M Headers, Borla Exhaust, Meziere Elec. H2O Pump, Canton Deep Sump Oil Pan, 100 HP OF TNT N2O!! , T56 Conversion w/ Pro 5.0 shifter, SPEC Stage 3 Clutch, Hotchkiss Subframe Conn., Lakewood Adj. Panhard Bar, Spohn Adj. LCA's, BMR Adj. T.A., Custom 12 bolt w/ 3:73's, Moser Axles, Eaton Posi, Moser Girdle
                11.6 @ 123mph (1.6 60' - getting there )

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                • #9
                  Yea very glad to hear it.
                  2002 Electron Blue Vette, 1SC, FE3/Z51, G92 3.15 gears, 308.9 RWHP 321.7 RWTQ (before any mods), SLP headers, Z06 exhaust, MSD Ignition Wires, AC Delco Iridium Spark Plugs, 160 t-stat, lots of ECM tuning

                  1995 Z28, many mods, SOLD

                  A proud member of the "F-Body Dirty Dozen"

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                  • #10
                    Cool! I like the fact that he wanted a checkup after a few days. Sounds like you found a decent mechanic.

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                    • #11
                      great news!!!
                      DWS
                      Silver M6 '95 Formula-sold to MCKNBRD

                      Zaino all the way!!

                      '03 Z06....Donaldson Blackwing, CAGS, '04 Z06 shocks, ceramic pads

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