The Goat

[Z Ya Later]

I think if I had the money and was looking 4 a brand new summer car id definatly consider a gto, I like the sleeper look just not to fond of the fact that it looks like every other pontiac. anyone think they would do better with n/a v-6 and awd models? although i think n/a v-6 sports cars are a waste part of the gto's problem is that it has no options or standout features. they should have atleast made a engine 455 unique to it, or badged it a gn and put a turbo 3.8 in i'd be saving my pennies right now

Naw, it wouldn't fit the GN. To summarize what one magazine said...

In a world of well-mannered, well-dressed sports cars, the Grand National is an axe-wielding barbarian that destroys everything in its path - C&D I believe

The GN deserves to stay as-is I feel...an awesome beast that still sets the pace for straight-line performance lol. But, it would be an interesting take for Buick if they were to do it

[alenstein]

I agree it, it really doesnt to the GTO name any justice. But if your looking for more of a quick luxury car then thats the way to go. They definately dont drive like a traditional american sports car.

Whats a traditional american sports car, all power and no handling, handles like a boat when going into a turn wasn't that the case with most of the 60's 70's muscle cars?

I like the new GTO.

THings of the past: 1965 GTO, and 65 cents per gallon, I don't see 455 coming back. These muscle cars were affordable ,not anymore, rebadged coupes that every kid could afford, price is the cuprit for me as for the new GTO.

Retro is nice,but short lived. I hope they come out with new designs, new modern engine and decent gas mileage.

LT1 is the past for me, jus like L98 in the vette, slowly a dying breed.

And where the hell is Jay in all of this. LOL

[JUICEDSS]

snip......
With what I have in mind I can see easy low 12's. I don't think there are many cars on the road that will keep up with me when I am done.
snip......

Not trying to stir this up, but low 12's are a dime a dozen around here. Heck, I was at 12.20 with just a 125 dry shot on my SS. I think you better get your car into the 10's before saying things like that. Low 12's these days are nothing.

[wolfdogs]

Naw, it wouldn't fit the GN. To summarize what one magazine said...

In a world of well-mannered, well-dressed sports cars, the Grand National is an axe-wielding barbarian that destroys everything in its path - C&D I believe

except in the twisties........ cause she's a straight line machine

[wolfdogs]

Not trying to stir this up, but low 12's are a dime a dozen around here. Heck, I was at 12.20 with just a 125 dry shot on my SS. I think you better get your car into the 10's before saying things like that. Low 12's these days are nothing.

so true, Ralph...we got a few in Stafford and Fredericksburg that are in the mid 11's......... just cruising the streets on Fri and Sat night......

[raroZ28]

But...but...but...its just a six

Ok, then I get to bring the CBR. It's just a 4

[raroZ28]

Not trying to stir this up, but low 12's are a dime a dozen around here. Heck, I was at 12.20 with just a 125 dry shot on my SS. I think you better get your car into the 10's before saying things like that. Low 12's these days are nothing.

Yes, but on the streets around here, not many people run that. This is a club of a few hundred members nationwide. And 12's is lowballing it. From what I heard I'll be over 400 HP with possible 11 second timeslips. I just don't want to say that and sound like a jackass later when I click off chitty times.

[Rob]

GN's were great at one thing, going straight. I loved my 87 but stopping and turning just weren't part of the package

This is the perfect all around car, what I had before buying the GTO. Nothing like going faster than a GN but be able to stop and turn on a dime!


The very first time I drove the new GTO completely reminded me of my 96 WS6. The way it accelerated, cornered, stopped, everything. It was very surprising to say the least. The GTO was actually faster stock vs. stock at the track to, 13.5 vs 13.2.

At the F-Body Nationals, the goat held its own on the roadcourse against all the F-Body's. I was extremely pleased at well it did, although the brakes did start to go to early it seemed.

All the bashing usually comes from people that haven't driven the car, let alone even sat in it. I like the understated looks. It definitely doesn't have the over the top look of the WS6, which I don't think would fit the car at all.

[95TransAm]

Just read all 6 pages thus far....quite a thread.

For me, this is how I feel.

The old gto's were classics......they will live in my heart and on my shelf (too many lil die casts ) forever. The new GTO is also an amazing machine. I hated it at first, couldn't deal with the styling, but things have persuaded me since. The only GTO I would drive (if I had the luxury of being able to buy one brand new) would be the one Ken has....no two ways about it. Do I like the looks of it better than our f-bodies or a vette....no.....do I like the engineering better than our f-bods.....yes. Do I like the fact that pontiac has a RWD V8.....yes. Would I take a new cobra over it...no cuz I hate ford, and I hate the new styling of the mustang. Does any of this mean I am right or wrong....no.

It's all about what you want.

If there is one thing though I have learned, it's that with the change of technology, other things (including styling) have to change as well. I remember learning about a crumple zone and how cars are designed to take the blow of an impact rather than your body (thus the reason why a car may look demolished after a somewhat "smaller" impact). Other factors like handling, weight distribution, etc.... are all taken in to account when designing a vehicle.

I'm not an engineer at GM though, I don't know why they choose to design vehicles the way they do; but I would imagine the factors I mentioned as well as many others are taken in to account first and the styling is factored around those variables. It seems today that if you want that sleek sportscar look + power + handling = vette or any other "high end" (pricey) car.

Does is look like one of the many beautiful older cars that once roamed the road, including the classic GTO's.....no. Does any car look like that....no.

Is it an amazing machine from an engineering standpoint....IMO...yes.
Is it one h*ll of a bang for the buck....IMO....yes.

That's just my square root of 487,204 divided by 8 multiplied by .54 rounded to the nearest hundrenth.....

then take that number and subtract it from 50...cube that number and round to nearest hundrenth once again.

Subtract this number from the sum of the number of planets in our solar system (pluto included) + the square root of 225 and multiply it by 2 tenths....and once again....round to the nearest hundrenth.

Okay....so I picked a totally random number and figured a way to get to the infamous 2 cents......I still like math and I'm still even a bigger loser

[N20LT4Bird]

I'm somewhat insulted that you think I'm stupid enough to believe I could take an 05 GTO in my current state. I do have more mods than the sig says, that's outdated and I'm too lazy to change it out. Don't worry, you are not the barer of anything. I didn't say "Next summer" just for the hell of it. Did you say that just to come to Wolf's defense or something? I don't understand... I will be doing a valve job w/oversize valves, fully ported heads and I'll be cammed. I have the springs, retainers, locks, seals, timing kit, etc... I just need to decide on a cam. I have a full bmr suspension. With what I have in mind I can see easy low 12's. I don't think there are many cars on the road that will keep up with me when I am done. I took a $600 hit with my other car dropping a valve. There went my cam and head work. Plus I bought a motorcycle. This coming winter the Camaro will be put away... When he comes out he will be a whole new monster.

.

Dont be insulted my friend. I just wanted to be clear that the GTO is not a slug. Despite the other comments made to you, low 12's/high 11's is not easy territory to break into with an N/A LT1.....trust me im running an extra 33 cubes and 100 shot of juice to do it over my ported heads/cam (you can read a sig )......and thats after blowing up a couple transmissions, then finally a few clutches after the conversion, a rear end, a host of suspension parts, etc. Its not easy so if you make it you have my congrats up front!

Just for the record, I bet the stock/slightly modded 05 GTO will still give you a run.

[Z Ya Later]

Oh I never said the GN was the best at handling or stopping, believe me I know its not. But, the aftermarket has offered up ways to change that . But, there's something to be said about running 11's with only $2k in mods .

[gimp19]

They are still my all time fav. I love that stealth look, they look dangerous.

[Rob]

But, there's something to be said about running 11's with only $2k in mods .

You got that right, even moreso in the TTA. I ran 12.1 with about $500 in mods and that included the Nittos Probably could have hit the 11's with race gas and more boost. After that, new turbo, injectors, downpipe, cat back, converter, alky kit, etc to run low-mid 11's.

[Joe 1320]

You got that right, even moreso in the TTA. I ran 12.1 with about $500 in mods and that included the Nittos Probably could have hit the 11's with race gas and more boost. After that, new turbo, injectors, downpipe, cat back, converter, alky kit, etc to run low-mid 11's.

To me, that's possibly the best overall later model f-body out there when it comes to having the brute power, great weight balance, handling and cruising. The only thing you can say is that it didn't sound like the traditional V8 musclecar. i've got to get one for myself some day. I've had friends that owned them but never managed to add one to the collection. I've been really contemplating a turbo 3.8 conversion in a 4th gen. I know I could build a solid 10 second car that could still handle.

[Rob]

To me, that's possibly the best overall later model f-body out there when it comes to having the brute power, great weight balance, handling and cruising. The only thing you can say is that it didn't sound like the traditional V8 musclecar. i've got to get one for myself some day. I've had friends that owned them but never managed to add one to the collection. I've been really contemplating a turbo 3.8 conversion in a 4th gen. I know I could build a solid 10 second car that could still handle.

They are great cars. I also wanted to do a 4th gen but I wanted to be on the different side and run a 6spd. I know it wouldn't have been faster at the track, but it would be fun on the street Even with the low 51-5200 shift point. Pontiac is the only one that I know of that built one. It hits the show circuit every once in awhile. Very cool.

10 second turbo V6 4th gen shouldn't be too hard to do.

Or since we're going off topic, make a turbo V6 GTO and turn it into a modern GN