'02 vs '93

[Jay 02 TA ws6]

307 RWHP is enough to get you into the low 13s.

307 rwhp using the 15% drivetrain loss shows 361 HP at the crank.

If your traps are in the low 100's, perhaps it is your shifting that needs work. 2.1 60 foots aren't that great, but they are not absolutely awful either. With that much power, you have a low 13 second car, *maybe* high 12's if everything goes right for you.

The trap speed shouldn't vary by driver ability - as long as the car is being pushed to its limit and shifted comparably. No matter what your 60 foot is, your trap speed will indicate the power of your car as long as your shifting is consistent. By this I mean, a better driver would likely not be able to squeeze out a higher trap speed than you, unless you aren't shifting with authority. I should ask... 6 speed or auto? If it is an auto, everything I just said is pretty irrelevant, lol...

Put a 2002 LS1 f-body on the dyno next to a 2002 C5 Vette, and the average difference in horsepower produced by the cars should turn out to be statistically insignificant if a large enough sample is used... at least this is what I have always been told.

Perhaps I'm wrong, but I just can't imagine a 2002 Firehawk struggled to hit 13's stock.

[Joe 1320]

Originally posted by Jay 02 TA ws6

Perhaps I'm wrong, but I just can't imagine a 2002 Firehawk struggled to hit 13's stock.

Believe it Jay... It's what I've been saying all along, you have a performance freak. There are a few others out there as well, but the overwhelming majority are in the mid 13s at 103-105 when shifted properly. I can't tell you how many times I went against a stock LS1 from a local club and the owners were seriously dismayed when they didn't drive past me. They were soooo convinced of the superiority of the LS1. As a matter of fact, most had to play catch up only to match my acceleration at the end of the quarter but still a length or two back. Only the very best of the stock LS1s go quicker.

You should be very happy yours is on the upper end of the performance spectrum.

[Jay 02 TA ws6]

Originally posted by Joe 1320
Believe it Jay... It's what I've been saying all along, you have a performance freak. There are a few others out there as well, but the overwhelming majority are in the mid 13s at 103-105 when shifted properly. I can't tell you how many times I went against a stock LS1 from a local club and the owners were seriously dismayed when they didn't drive past me. They were soooo convinced of the superiority of the LS1. As a matter of fact, most had to play catch up only to match my acceleration at the end of the quarter but still a length or two back. Only the very best of the stock LS1s go quicker.

You should be very happy yours is on the upper end of the performance spectrum.

But in his specific case, Joe... 307 RWHP is not on the lower end of things... There is no way 13's should be a struggle.

[Joe 1320]

Originally posted by Jay 02 TA ws6
307 RWHP is not on the lower end of things... There is no way 13's should be a struggle.

There are so many variables.... altitude, temperature, humidity, accuracy of the Dyno for quoted HP figures, driveline effeciency, available traction, and so on. Whay would really be telltale evidence is a timeslip with ALL the times. Everything from 60' to every point along the track. It could very well be a high speed lean out or knock retard due to false knock. That last one is responsible for many LT1s not running to their potential.

[Brandon94za4]

When I had my 94z that ran 13.1's at 109 I use to run against ls1's at the track and they didn't put down any outstanding times. The ones I personally saw ran anywhere from 13.0-14.0 and some of them had exhaust and induction work. They both have their advantages and disadvantages. I choose to keep buying low mile lt1 cars and mod the crap out of them. I could afford to buy and ls1 but don't care for the looks. I am sure that is exactly how some ls1 guys feel about the lt1 cars. It's all about what you like. who keeps their car stock long enough to race stock vs. stock anyway? Not me thats for sure

[tabahr]

Originally posted by Brandon94za4
I choose to keep buying low mile lt1 cars and mod the crap out of them. I could afford to buy and ls1 but don't care for the looks.

I agree. Low mile LT1 cars can be had without a car loan, leaving money for mods. Not only that but I think the LS1 camaro nose is ugly. Someday I will own an LS1 T/A 6speed convert.... When the prices come down.

[fastTa]

Hey Jay your 13.3 at 109 is not a freak at all. I can't even count how many times I've seen bone stock LS1's (factory paper filter and all) go 12.9 - 13.3 @ 107-110 mph on stock tires with good shifting. I've been going to t the track for over 10 years now and I've seen lots and lots of f-bods run the 1/4. In my experience it has been an extremely, extremely rare occasion when a bone stock LT1 powered f-body has beaten an LS1 powered f-body. The stock LS1 simply makes more horsepower. I personally am witness to this as I have spent alot of time around a chassis dyno doing recent tuning. The stock 02' LS1's with a M6 I have seen on the dyno typically make around 300-310 rwhp where the stock LT1's with a M6 are usually around 275-285 rwhp. Facts are Facts.

[Jay 02 TA ws6]

13.3 isn't all that special I aqgree. But 109 is most definitely on the higher end of the spectrum. And since the trap speed indicates the car's ability, whereas the ET indicates driver ability, I'd say I have myself a pretty strong car

With a little practice, maybe my driving can one day be as strong

[fastTa]

109 mph on a stock '02 WS6 is definitely not bad at all. Practice power shifting, that is shifting without ever letting of the throttle and just pushing the clutch enough to slam the next gear!

[Rhode Island Red]

my car is an m6. In matter of fact, to rule out driver, I had an 11 sec hawk driver drive my car, he did indeed drive the car 2 tenths faster, but his best MPH was actually 104.22X not near my 104.7 .. my car is programmed from GM to be PIG RICH .. stock a/f seesms to be inthe 11's to 1

there is 20 rwhp locked away in tuning alone that I have empriaracly witnessed.

next spring I am getting a dyno tune of all OEM stock parts and having the PCM reflashed accordingly

hmm GM has no timing at shift, and the power of the LS1 after hooking seems to be lacking (all due to stock tuning)

BTW I have a TA hawk... so my car is heavy!! with a 190 LB person in it it exceeds 3800 LBS

Maybe with an awesome driver the car would get 13.2's ... but anything beyond that I sincerely doubt for my specific car as it currently stands... and I ~70 1/4 strips to back it up.

BTW I have the SLP auburn option adn the bilstein susp. if this explains my crappy 60's