Loose Change-9-11-01-DISCUSS

[FroSSty]

This was cut from http://www.f-body.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20436

"middle of the page, watch or d/l from google...long but well worth it, imho.
Loose Change

Very Interesting.

More like very gut wrenching...I say believe what you want but to me it is very clear what happened...What will we, as Americans, do about it? Nothing...but eat up every lie our government spews.

God bless those brave men/women and unfortunate victims!! They will be forever in my heart.

and i do mean kid, he's only like 20

I hope you are not impying he is incompetent because of his age. I haven't seen "9/11 conspiracys: fact or fiction" yet but I may look into it."

DISCUSS

[FroSSty]

(MunsonGTA) basically what you're saying is that you belive our own government is responsible for 9/11?

I have seen a lot of proof to backup my opinion. Please don't go on thinking that the federal government is only looking out for your best interests.

[Jeff_in_Atl]

I don't see any proof. All I see is peoples twisted vivid imagination running wild. Anybody who believes the Bush administration arranged 9/11 is a certifiable nut case. That's all I'm going to say.

[BrdWAtti2d]

All I'm going to say on this issue is this; if you look for conspiracies, you'll find them anywhere you look. The fact is our small minds have a very difficult time wrapping around the fact that an individual nut, a group of nut cases, or some random accident can have such a profound effect on our lives, whether it be Lee Harvey Oswald, a tragic automobile accident or a group of Muslim radicals. If you look at any incident where we were all so emotional moved as a nation you will also see the conspiracy theories rise. If we don't allow ourselves to believe that someone so insignificant can so easily threaten our security we can rest easier, when the real fact is, yes some lone nut can end our life at the drop of a hat. It happens everyday, sorry to burst anyone's bubble.

[Steel2686]

I saw the loose change articles a while back. I just can't buy into it. I'm not in the belief that our government is looking out for our best interests, but taking down the towers makes little sense.

[Joe 1320]

They way I see it.......

Don't care. The fact that an event like this even happenend and a bunch of towel headed @zzwipes were dancing in the desert with delight, cursing the very core of freedom and announcing to the world "Bow down to our version of Islam or we will kill you" gives me cause to look at only those facts that need to be addressed.

[ConElite]

That was one of the most interesting movies I have ever seen. A lot of people were mad b/c these "kids" made it and it got so much attention. If you pay attention to it, The entire movie is nothing but facts. They are all backed up on their website. I remember seeing on-line a video where the editors of Popular Mechanics and some other guy (cant recall who it was) were debating the facts behind the movie. Let me tell you, Those "Kids" and one in particular, (not sure if it was Dylan Avery or not) was holding his own and at some points caused the guys from PM to stay quiet. Can all the movie be true? Doubt it. Does a lot of it make sense? Hell yeah. You call us nut cases b/c you refuse to think that there is that slight possibility that the government would do anything to hurt their people. Simply in the fact of the reaction of the president. In an emergency like this, still sat there like there was nothing wrong for a good while. That alone to me people, Is NUTS!!! (I'm surprised he didn't go on Vacation to his ranch when it happened) How when the firefighters arrived at the towers, and they were shocked to see windows blown out at the bottom floors and how people reported an explosion going off in the basement a little after the plane hit. I don't know. Very interesting documentary indeed.

[ConElite]

We look down at them for :

"Bow down to our version of Islam or we will kill you"

Yet slowly but surely we are forcing our beliefs on them. They're method of living is extreme to us, as ours is to them. Religion is simply another reason to hate eachother. I'm by no means a "Peace in the world" and "Everyone should love eachother" kinda guy, but in all reality, Peoples mind wash beliefs are the root of all this hatred.

Granted, I think they should suffer for cheering when this happened (Nothing but Hispanics in my school), But in a sense we are hypocrites for judging them and pointing the finger and saying "YOU WILL CHANGE!!!"

[Joshu]

Several of their facts in the origional loose change were proven wrong and they accepted it and corrected themselves. They are currently making another loose change. I for one am not a conspiracy theorist. But some things still don't add up about 9-11. The whole pentagon thing bothers me.Why would the FBI run to local hotels to confiscate security cameras that filmed outside during the crash? Our nation's defense bulding does not have enough camera's filming the area that shoot more than 1 image every 5 seconds? Please!? The damage done to the pentagon does not reflect one crashing into it at at least 200 knots.


We are talking about a 269,434 lb plane, hitting the pentagon wall at around 300-400 MPH
I'm not accusing anyone or the government of doing this. I just want a better explanation.

[Christopherrr]

Yet slowly but surely we are forcing our beliefs on them.

I can't disagree with you more...back that statement up. We're not the ones beheaded soldiers, degrading women, slughtering people and straping bombs on ourselves in the name to convert people...force? Come on.

[Christopherrr]

http://www.popularmechanics.com/tech...42.html?page=1

Let science answer your questions.

[Joe 1320]

We look down at them for :

Yet slowly but surely we are forcing our beliefs on them. They're method of living is extreme to us, as ours is to them. Religion is simply another reason to hate eachother. I'm by no means a "Peace in the world" and "Everyone should love eachother" kinda guy, but in all reality, Peoples mind wash beliefs are the root of all this hatred.

Granted, I think they should suffer for cheering when this happened (Nothing but Hispanics in my school), But in a sense we are hypocrites for judging them and pointing the finger and saying "YOU WILL CHANGE!!!"

I don't understand your point. The fact is, we have a policy that allows religious freedom. There are numerous examples of every peaceful religious faction right here in America, we do not ask them to change. What we do not allow is a bunch of criminals who kill and murder under a fanatisicm based religion that dictates killing anyone who doesn't conform to their strict way of thinking. Actually we don't tolerate this from those that do not claim to be religiously motivated, why tolerate it from religious fanatics? What we want is peaceful co-existance.

All we really wish for is democratically elected goverments, voted by it's country's residents whom all can get along and stop fighting each other!

[Joshu]

I can't disagree with you more...back that statement up. We're not the ones beheaded soldiers, degrading women, slughtering people and straping bombs on ourselves in the name to convert people...force? Come on.

We are. It's called democracy and look what it has got us. An out of control executive branch (what happened to checks and balances?). We also have a very partisan goverment.

[ConElite]

I can't disagree with you more...back that statement up. We're not the ones beheaded soldiers, degrading women, slughtering people and straping bombs on ourselves in the name to convert people...force? Come on.

In all reality, Let them kill themselves. Let them Abuse THEIR woman. As Long as it does not effect us we are fine. If they were that much of a global threat, Bomb it with H-bombs until it glows, But NO WAIT A MINUTE, We need the oil over there and we need an excuse to higher gas prices in order to Cover the Mistake This war is. I support the troops, not the war. Like White Devil said above, Thats one thing that cant be explained. As the guys from the Movie said, "If there is nothing to hide, Why not just release the tapes.!"

I remember when I was in DC. I saw the side were the plane hit. There is a Mall parking lot 3 stories tall. That plane would of had to slam the ground pretty hard and then slide on the lawn before hitting the Pentagon b/c there is simply not space for the Plane to fly right into the Building and not smack the ground. Very interest.

[Joe 1320]

Several of their facts in the origional loose change were proven wrong and they accepted it and corrected themselves. They are currently making another loose change. I for one am not a conspiracy theorist. But some things still don't add up about 9-11. The whole pentagon thing bothers me.Why would the FBI run to local hotels to confiscate security cameras that filmed outside during the crash? .

Simple. To see every angle possible from both government and civilian cameras. Evidence gathering 101.

The damage done to the pentagon does not reflect one crashing into it at at least 200 knots. We are talking about a 269,434 lb plane, hitting the pentagon wall at around 300-400 MPH
I'm not accusing anyone or the government of doing this. I just want a better explanation.

Simple. I can tell you from a flight dynamics perspective. Keeping a 300-400mph airplane on a direct target is a biotch. I seriuosly doubt anything but a very experienced pilot is going to be able to put a jumbo jet on a specific spot with the wings exactly level. That means that likely the plane would not have hit the way the photochopped examples show. I could see the plane very easily being overcontrolled and coming in with enough yaw to strike the building in a way that would cause the damage exactly as seen in the photos.

Also keep in mind that the plane is made of aluminum, it is hollow and fragile. The fact that is stays together in forward flight is due to the structural design. Move the plane off axis at speed and the slightest stike could cause catastophic failure of the stucture. You see, airplanes are a very different animal than people realize.